The betting is interesting. It is heavily skewed in the sense that three goals in the game either way starts at 21/1. A 0-0 is almost dicounted at 9/1. But a 3-3 is 39/1. 4-2 is 59/1 and 79/1 in favour of United. Interesting odds. Get a free £10 bet here and all the odds.

The name is Wenger…Arsene Wenger. Sorry I missed that…?

The two old foes Arsene Wenger and Sir Alex Ferguson came together in September for a charity function to raise funds for the League Managers Association Benevolent Trust. Hostilities will doubtless be resumed on Saturday at noon when Arsenal’s porous defence - eight goals conceded in three games meets Manchester United’s elegant gunslinging quartet of Tevez, Rooney, Ronaldo and Berbatov. United though shipped three goals themselves to Hull last week.  Arsenal have scored 15 in five games before tonight’s Champions League game and have a day’s advantage in terms of rest. Ten of their last 11 goals have come from different players.

The betting makes interesting reading for what could be a high scoring game. 4-4 is 129/1 which is not beyond the bounds of possibilities. In fact anything involving one side to score three goals is more than 21/1 looks tempting.

All the Arsenal v Manchester United odds are here

Back it the other way round, as away wins and you would win £2,340 for £1. But that won’t happen?

The newly promoted teams have shown well in the opening games of the season. But it has been more defence than attack and none of the trio look to be packing too much in the goals department.

Hull even though they are third and perhaps halfway to safety only have a goal difference of plus one. West Brom who are ninth have a difference of zero.

Stoke look to be in trouble. Their points have come from a surpising and untypical 3-2 win against Aston Villa and holding on for a point at Anfield. The rest they have lost and in the Carling  Cup they only beat Reading on penalties. Their goal difference is already minus six. Next up is Tottenham at home which by rights they should not win. Spurs are 6/5 to win.

West Ham will be nervous about a trip to Hull after last week’s defeat to Blackburn and Hull’s away form in the capital beating Spurs and Arsenal. A tough, possibly decisive call that one. The book says 6/5 Hull but Gianfranco Zola and Steve Clarke may be making their mark and do not have all their players away on international duty.

West Brom travel to Manchester United who, given that everyone returns from international duty un-injured, look to be purring again.  Or was last week’s victory more of an omen that Blackburn are on the slide?

Get all the Premier League betting here

The big betting money has been following the bigger scores. Liverpool’s last gasp win at Manchester City 3-2 was 24/1. Unfancied Bolton’s 3-1 win at West Ham was 49/1. The newly promotoed clubs have done well but have not been scoring and only Stoke’s 0-0 at Liverpool stands out as a mark of their resilience.

Most teams have enough about them to suggest that the bigger teams may not have it all their own way, which points to goals scored. Or at least Chelsea and Manchester United may not have it all their own way. For the rest it looks like a dog fight. Joe Kinnear could in fact be Newcastle need. A bit of the crazy gang approach from the old Wimbledon days and a few **** was enough to stifle Everton. Tottenham must find some form. Hull must be halfway to survival so that suggests another team to go down, of which, as it painful as it may be to show no faith in a young English manager, Blackburn under Paul Ince look possible candidates. They are away to Bolton next time around which will be a good test of their Premier League viability.

Fulham entertain Sunderland which will also be a six pointer one way or the other. Fulham have been playing the football and losing. Sunderland have been stealing results. Stytle meets substance.

Get all the England soccer odds here

For all hype and punditry, the early proof of the Premier League 2008/9 is that money does not buy success. It can. But it doesn’t look like it for the clubs that spend big. Or for clubs that want or need instant success, one player or more is not necessarily the panacea.  Spurs and Nerwcastle fans must be wondering where it all went so badly wrong.

Tottenham are 749/1 to win the title which is rather more than a long shot and Juande Ramos has dismantled Martin Jol’s side and fielding a bunch of strangers. To add insult Jol has taken Hamburg to the top of the Bundesliga in less time than Ramos has taken to undo his good work. Rumours now link ex Chelsea boss Avram Grant to White Hart Lane? The board’s endorsement of the manager has been made public. 

Mike Ashley has money but seemingly refused  Kevin Keegan’s demands to spend big. In fact he has not  spent very much at all and that could be even worse. A new owner, bringing Keegan back even with money for a relegation dog fight looks less likely at present than a steep fast descent through the Championship to League One, a la Leeds.  In that light Roy Kinnear may not be such a bad choice for the months ahead…

Robinho could not make the difference yet for Manchester City against Liverpool on Sunday, and it is pretty unclear if Rafa Benitez’s summer spending will take Liverpool above Chelsea or Manchester United. Even at Stamford Bridge on Sunday it was interesting how far the pundits got it wrong…Villa to win 2-0 was a 40/1 shot and much touted about on radio and TV, Chelsea were a predictable boring 5/1 for the same score. But  Villa in fact have spent heavily this summer and transparently it has not made enough of a difference. Chelsea on the other hand even with more than half a team out with injury, fielded what many pre-the game had down as a second string side but preceeded to produce another masterclass in modern football. The lesson there is to start with a good manager, or preferably a great one. Or even better with four in succession- Claudio Ranieri, Jose Mourinho, maybe Avram Grant if only because the obituary on his legacy was that he didn’t mess things up, and Felipe Scolari.

Sir Alex Ferguson has also demonstrated over the years the art of buying important players and taking time to integrate them. It might have been overlooked that he has in fact spent £60million on Dimitiar Berbatov and confirming the Carlos Tevez deal this summer. Cristiano Ronaldo was a steal at £13m. Wayne Rooney was £28million. No wonder the forwards looked in good form against Blackburn. His purchases though are additions to the squad to embellish the overall play. They are not wholesale overhauls. That United forward line has been groomed through since the decision to sell Ruud Van Nistelroy in 2006.

Great teams are built on time and foresight. Arsenal are still in contention through  an investment in youth; exravagent sums spent on teenagers whom they can develop and sell on. Arsene Wenger seems to believe the brio of youth is a necessary part of successful chemistry. The great Ajax side of 1994-96 was built on that premise too.

JK Which one is Simon Bird [Daily Mirror's north-east football writer]?

SB Me.

JK You’re a cunt.

SB Thank you.

JK Which one is Hickman [Niall, football writer for the Express]? You are out of order. Absolutely fucking out of order. If you do it again, I am telling you you can fuck off and go to another ground. I will not come and stand for that fucking crap. No fucking way, lies. Fuck, you’re saying I turned up and they [Newcastle's players] fucked off.

SB No Joe, have you read it, it doesn’t actually say that. Have you read it?

JK I’ve fucking read it, I’ve read it.

SB It doesn’t say that. Have you read it?

JK You are trying to fucking undermine my position already.

SB Have you read it, it doesn’t say that. I knew you knew they were having a day off.

JK Fuck off. Fuck off. It’s your last fucking chance.

SB You read the copy? It doesn’t say that you didn’t know.

JK What about the headline, you think that’s a good headline?

SB I didn’t write the headline, you read the copy.

JK You are negative bastards, the pair of you.

SB So if I get a new job next week would I take the first day off? No I wouldn’t. If I get a new job should I call my boss and tell him I am taking the first day off?

JK It is none of your fucking business. What the fuck are you going to do? You ain’t got the balls to be a fucking manager. Fucking day off. Do I want your opinion. Do I have to listen to you?

SB No, you can listen to who you want.

JK I had a 24-hour meeting with the entire staff.

SB Joe, you are only here six weeks, you could have done that on Sunday, or Saturday night.

JK No, no, no. I didn’t want to do it. I had some other things to do.

SB What? More important things?

JK What are you? My personal secretary? Fuck off.

SB You could have done the meeting Saturday night or Sunday. You could have had them watching videos, you could have organised them.

JK I was meeting the fucking chairman the owner, everyone else. Talking about things.

SB It is a valid point that was made in there. A valid point.

JK I can’t trust any of you.

Niall Hickman Joe, no one could believe that on your first day at your new club, the first-team players were not in. No one could believe it in town. Your first day in the office.

JK My first day was with the coaches. I made the decision that I wanted to get as much information out of them.

NH But why Monday, no one could believe it?

JK I’m not going to tell you anything. I don’t understand where you are coming from. You are delighted that Newcastle are getting beat and are in the state they are? Delighted, are you?

NH Certainly not. No one wants to see them get beaten, why would we?

JK I have done it before. It is going to my fucking lawyers. So are about three others. If they can find something in it that is a court case it is going to court. I am not fucking about. I don’t talk to fucking anybody. It is raking up stories. You are fucking so fucking slimy you are raking up players that I got rid of. Players that I had fallen out with. You are not asking Robbie Earle, because he is sensible. You are not asking Warren Barton? No. Because he is fucking sensible. Anyone who had played for me for 10 years at any level … [but] you will find some cunt that …

Other journalist How long is your contract for Joe?

JK None of your business.

SB Well it is actually, because we cover the club. The club say you are here to the end of October, then you say six to eight games which would take it to the end of November. We are trying to clarify these issues. We are getting no straight answers from anyone. How long are you here for. It is a dead simple question. And you don’t know …

JK I was told the length of contract. Then I was told that possibly the club could be sold in that time. That is as far as I know. That’s it finished. I don’t know anything else. But I have been ridiculed. He’s trying to fucking hide, he’s trying to do this or that.

There follows an exchange regarding the circumstances under which Kinnear had met the owner Mike Ashley and executive director (football) Dennis Wise.

Steve Brenner (football writer for the Sun) We are all grown men and can come in here and sit around and talk about football, but coming in here and calling people cunts?

JK Why? Because I am annoyed. I am not accepting that. If it is libellous, it is going to where I want it to go.

Newcastle press officer What has been said in here is off the record and doesn’t go outside.

Journalist Well, is that what Joe thinks?

JK Write what you like. Makes no difference to me. Don’t affect me I assure you. It’ll be the last time I see you anyway. Won’t affect me. See how we go at Everton and Chrissy [Chris Hughton, assistant manager] can do it, someone else can do it. Don’t trust any of yous. I will pick two local papers and speak to them and the rest can fuck off. I ain’t coming up here to have the piss taken out of me. I have a million pages of crap that has been written about me. I’m ridiculed for no reason. I’m defenceless. I can’t get a point in, I can’t say nothing, I can’t do nothing, but I ain’t going to be negative. Then, half of you, most of you are trying to get into the players. I’m not going to tell you what the players think of you, so then you try and get into them in some way or another, so I’ve got a split camp or something like that, something like that. It’s ongoing. It just doesn’t stop.

Journalist It’s only been a week.

JK Exactly. It feels more like a year.

Journalist It’s early days for you to be like this.

JK No, I’m clearing the air. And this is the last time I’m going to speak to you. You want to know why, I’m telling you. This is the last time. You can do what you like.

Journalist But this isn’t going to do you or us any good.

JK I’ll speak to the supporters. I’m going to tell them what the story is. I’m going to tell them. I don’t think they’ll interpret it any different, I don’t think they’ll mix it up, I don’t think they’ll miss out things. I mean, one of them last week said to me … I was talking about in that press conference where you were there, I said something like “Well, that’s a load of bollocks …”

Journalist “Bollocks to that” is what you said.

JK Bollocks to that. And what goes after that?

Journalist That was it.

JK No it wasn’t, no it wasn’t. What was after it? I don’t know if it was your paper, but what went after it?

Journalist I don’t know.

JK It even had the cheek to say “bollocks to Newcastle”.

Journalist I didn’t write that.

JK That was my first fucking day. What does that tell you? What does that tell you?

Journalist Where was that? Which paper said that?

JK I’ve got it. I can’t remember. It was one of the Sundays, not a Saturday. It was a Sunday.

Journalist But you didn’t say that to the Sundays, you said that to us. That was during the Monday press conference.

JK I’ll bring it in and show it to you. Why would I want to say that?

Journalist Are you saying that someone has reported you saying “bollocks to Newcastle?”

JK Yes. Lovely.

Journalist I don’t know who’s reported that.

JK I’ll tell you what, I’ll bring it in.

Journalist That’s obviously going to damage you. That’s not a good thing. But I don’t think someone’s done that. We have to have some sort of relationship with you.

JK So have I. But I haven’t come in here for you lot to take the piss out of me. And if I’m not flavour of the month for you, it don’t fucking bother me. I’ve got a job to do. And I’m going to do it to the best of my ability. I’m not going to spend any more time listening to any crap or reading any crap. Stick to the truth and the facts. And don’t twist anything.

Journalist You know, you know the game …

JK Of course I know, but I don’t have to like it.

Journalist Today we’ll print the absolute truth, that you think we’re cunts, we can all fuck off and we’re slimy. Is that fair enough?

JK Do it. Fine. Fucking print it. Am I going to worry about it? Put in also that it’ll be the last time I see you. Put that in as well. Good. Do it.

Much, much later after long discussions over whether Kinnear had promised Alan Shearer and Kevin Keegan would be returning to the club

Press officer Let’s get on to football. Let’s have an agreement that everything said so far, if anyone has got their tapes on, it’s wiped off and we’re not discussing it.

Journalist But that’s what Joe has said he thinks of us.

Press officer I’m saying don’t push it. Let’s accept what’s been said and try and move on.

Journalist: Move on to not doing any more press conferences?

PO: No, to doing something now.

Journalist: What, one press conference only?

(Silence)

Journalist: Any knocks?

PO: Come on, let’s go football.

Journalist: What are your plans for training in the next three days? How’s the training going?

JK It’s going very well. No problems at all.

Journalist Enjoyed getting back in the swing of things?

JK Absolutely. I’ve loved every moment of it.

Bet on Manchester City v Chelsea

But what is not clear now is the first team squad is too small to compete. The manager’s job looks like a poisoned chalice. Smart money says Dennis Wise will agitate to bring Gus Poyet back up north to reform the successful partnership they had at Leeds. Poyet’s influence at Tottenham has also impressed and he may be itching to be more than Juande Ramos’s interpreter. But it will need some quick thinking or the Magpies risk falling out of the Premier League nest. Next up on Saturday 13th is Hull, mercifully at least it is at home. But Hull are 11/2 which is not bad odds.

Bet on Premier League here

In Madrid Robinho’s sale will be met by whistles not for the players of the coach but the club president Ramon Calderon. He leaves a gap on the left side of the team that Arjen Robben will be expected to fill but as both Chelsea and the Holland national team Robben is injured too often to be counted on to sign for his supper each week. It was Robinho who supplied the exctra magic that brought enough 1-0 wins to ensure the Liga title. What the Madridistas expected was striker because both Ruud Van Nistelroy and Raul are the wrong side of 30. What they got was Van der Vaart in midfield.

Calderon seems to have offended everyone. By courting Ronaldo and using Robinho as a make-weight he engineered the outcome he got without getting his star buy. By selling to Manchester City, he has offended Chelsea.

As for Robinho, it will be fascinating to see if he can integrate into the Premier League. For a Brazilian unhappy in Madrid, hopefully his agents will have pointed out that where Manchester has great clubs it is also miserable, cold and rainy and not just in November. Will he cope with Carling Cup nights at Barnsley and Bolton, although significantly he has said that the teaming up with fellow Brazilians Jo and Elano was a deciding factor. Although was it not Elano who went missing after the clocks went back last October?

Every time you fill up your pretrol tank you can be glad that you may be funding Manchester City’s future purchases in the January transfer window. Literally the name means the Father of the Gazelle. The city is modern, over populated, dynamic and the country is desserrt and oil perched on the Sahara. Oil was found in 1958 and helped by the British the present dynasty was founded. Before that the main industry was camel herding. The actual city itself is built on an island in the Persian Gulf and most of the population are immi8grant workers brought in vfrom across Asia to build the new city.